Sablelock (Sablock), Sabledonk, Sableye Honchkrow, Sableye Garchomp, …

by Ed ~ April 8th, 2010.

Sableye - SFSome call it the Secret Florida Deck. Others call it Sablelock (Sablock), Sabledonk, Sableye Honchkrow, or Sableye Garchomp. Does it win by donking? Does it win by locking your opponent? Does it win by starving them of resources? Does it win by controlling their hand? Let’s just say that it wins by making the opponent lose!

I’ve not seen the deck around here, but I can say that it is causing a bit of a stir on the interwebs. There are a bunch of people discussing this deck in various places. Let’s go through the list. No, not the decklist, yet. Here’s the list of who’s talking about the deck:

1) People begging for info about the deck that took 2 of the top 4 spots in Florida and was seen topping at other states.
2) People like Curry/Silvestro that obviously played the deck, but don’t want its secrets made public.
3) People that have played against the deck and either got donked or annoyed to death.
4) Trolls

Now we can add “5) Team Omar” to that list.  I’m not going to pretend that I know the deck.  I just want to fan the flames a bit, and see if we can get something going.  This is going to be a deck workshop, so I’ll post a quick and dirty version of the deck.  Hopefully I’ll get some good ideas from people, and we can fix the deck up.

From what I gather, the deck focuses on 2 things.  The first one is the donk.  Sableye with Special Dark Energy can do 50 on the first turn (under the proper conditions).  If you go second, it can Expert Belt, Crobat, etc for even more nastiness.  Garchomp C with Double Colorless Energy can do 30 on turn 1.  If you go second, an Energy Gain or Expert Belt can move you into the 50 damage category.  With all the Magikarp, Baltoy, Hoppip, Unown Q, etc. floating around these days, there’s a fair chance that you can get a turn 1 KO and maybe even a donk.

Giratina - PLThe second thing the deck seems to do well is limit the opponent’s ability to do anything useful.  This is accomplished by devastating their hand and messing up their draws.  Giratina’s Let Loose ability makes both players shuffle their hands into the deck and draw 4.  To the Giratina player, this is like a mini Uxie Set Up.  To the opponent, this is like a slap in the face (when played on turn 1).  You play your hand out, drop Giratina, get 4 new cards and hopefully the opponent had more than 4 so that it hurts them.  Then, if it’s turn 1, and you can’t donk, you can use Sableye to Impersonate Cyrus’s Initiative causing the opponent to lose between 0 and 2 cards (depending on coin flips).  Then the opponent starts the game with 2 to 4 cards in hand.  If you’re really nasty, you could drop a Chatot G between the Giratina and Impersonate to stop the opponent from drawing anything useful.

It seems that, in some ways, the deck plays like SP Toolbox.  To be honest, that may be because I have a faulty idea of how the deck is built.  At any rate, I think that the deck would play pretty fast and very frustrating (for the opponent).  Here’s the list I came up with.  Let me know what’s wrong with it or the writeup, so that I can improve them.

Cyrus Initiative - SV
Version 5

Pokemon: 19
4 Sableye
3 Crobat G
2 Honchkrow G
2 Garchomp G
2 Garchomp G LV.X
2 Uxie
2 Giratina (PL – Let Loose)
1 Ambipom G
1 Chatot MD

Trainers: 20
4 Poke Turn
4 Power Spray
3 Energy Gain
4 Super Scoop Up
2 Expert Belt
2 SP Radar
1 Luxury Ball

Supporters: 11
3 Team Galactic’s Wager
2 Cyrus’s Initiative
3 Pokemon Collector
2 Cyrus’s Conspiracy
1 Aaron’s Collection

Energy: 10
4 Special Dark
4 Double Colorless
2 Dark

Option: Remove 1 Crobat G to include Moonlight Stadium or Uxie LV.X. If you use Uxie LV.X, I recommend making room for at least one Bebe’s Search by removing a Cyrus’s Conspiracy or maybe a Pokemon Collector. Also, SP Radar can be replaced by Pokemon Communication, because there are so many basics in the deck.

Category: Deck Workshop | Tags: , , , ,
  • Manaphy

    I like the deck.
    However, Spiritomb in a Cursegar could be a problem (lock warp point and SSU) as Luxray lvx's power.
    I would go with 1-2-3 Moonlight Stadium. I like also TGM in this deck.
    I would drop a Chatot MD for another Crobat G

  • http://www.teamomar.com/ Ed

    You are right. Team Galactic's Mars would be a nice choice.

    I assume you're concerned about Giratina getting pulled up. I don't really care for the Moonlight, myself. It seems too situational, and it would take up too many spots. If retreat was a concern, I'd rather use Unown Q (with DCE, I suppose), because it's searchable with Pokemon Collector (which can be Impersonated). Warp Energy is another good option. That's just my taste, though. Some people prefer the stadium.

    Also, if you're concerned about Cursegar, I wouldn't want to lose the Chatot MD. It gives you the ability to lock their Spiritomb in place. If you're ahead on prizes, you can just Chatter your way to victory. If you're even, you can wait until time is called and then KO Spiritomb.

    The other option for this lock is Azelf LA. Reworking the deck for Azelf could help your other concern, too. If you ran Azelf and some Psy Energy, you could use Lock Up the Spiritomb (but it would get KO'd after a while unlike with Chatot). That Psy Energy could also be used to power up Giratina's attack.

    Thanks for the comment, Manaphy!

  • http://www.adamcapriola.com/ Adam Capriola

    I think you need some more basic darks, but looks pretty solid. I tweeted everyone about the article, I'll try to get you a link on the main site today too.

    Killer content here!

  • http://www.teamomar.com/ Ed

    Thanks! Hopefully we'll get some more good ideas/comments for the deck.

  • pikkdogs

    Interesting deck ed.

    It must be secret because even I haven't heard of it.

    I used to run an empoleon hand control deck, and this seems like its similar, but with a donk aspect to it.

    It seems like its nasty at the beginning but if the other person is able to setup, then I dont really see anyway the sablelock player could win.

    Thanks for letting us know about this.

  • http://www.teamomar.com/ Ed

    It would be difficult, but the early disruption can go a long way. Also, Honchkrow G and Garchomp C Lv. X are great snipers. They can add to the disruption. There are lots of decks that rely on setting up stuff on the bench to get going, and these snipers can KO them. I think it's an interesting mix of hand disruption, bench disruption, and donkability. I actually think that the donking isn't a big part of the deck. That mainly comes because people are running so many wimps lately.

  • http://www.sixprizes.com/deck-analysis/sablelock-aka-sableyegarchomp-deck-list-discussion/ Sablelock aka Sableye/Garchomp Deck List and Discussion | SixPrizes.com – Pokemon Cards Game Tips and Strategy
  • TDA

    doesnt the deck also run honchkrow sv to restore magikarps?

  • http://www.teamomar.com/ Ed

    Now that you mention it, I do recall that being discussed somewhere. Hmm. Thanks.

  • http://www.teamomar.com/ Ed

    I updated the post with another build of the deck which incorporates some of your comments/concerns.

  • Bank

    You loose to Mewtwo.

  • Jose Can C

    not to mention Machamp is a rough fight if they can set 1 up

  • http://www.adamcapriola.com/ Adam Capriola

    I don't think that makes much sense.

    I think 2 Giratina is probably enough btw, it seems like such a terrible starter.

  • http://www.teamomar.com/ Ed

    I think that the Honchkrow SV gives you the ability to get cheap prizes against some opponents. Even Baltoy can be a sniped OHKO. I'm not convinced that this is THE way to run the deck, but it is a good option. It also gives you an evolution to attack with in case of Mewtwo.

    You may be right about the 'Tina. I was also thinking more about the TGW. I know that it's been discussed a bit. A turn1 TGW can be very good if you win. I suppose that people that are good at the RPS can really use it well. The part that I hadn't really considered is that, with Sableye, you can do a second TGW if you lose the first one. If you win the first one, you can do TGM or Cy's Initiative for further insult.

  • b-rock

    You guys are missing several key cards and have replaced them with some pretty useless ones, though I won't blame you for ignorance.

  • PKMNPrime

    Which is why I think the list should include Uxie Lv. X (since you're already running 2 Uxie and a hefty amount of Warp'ing stuff already).

  • PKMNPrime

    Well aren't you cool, though I won't blame you for being arrogant.

  • http://www.teamomar.com/ Ed

    Name one that's missing.

  • http://www.teamomar.com/ Ed

    I updated the list again. I've bumped it up to “Version 4″. I think this version is a bit more focused.

  • b-rock

    Well you finally got the luxury ball in there, and you've got it mostly correct now with the new update, but there is absolutely no reason to have 4 crobat g's, if you want the so badly you could go with 3, but I'd stay at 2.

    “3 Team Galactic’s Wager
    2 Cyrus’s Initiative
    3 Pokemon Collector
    3 Cyrus’s Conspiracy”

    Where are your Bebe's and Aaron's?

    And a few others I'd recommend looking into would be an Uxie X, premier ball, chatot MD, Mewtwo X, moonlight stadium, and pokemon communication.

    I'll leave the rest to you guys.

  • http://www.teamomar.com/ Ed

    In the current version, Bebe's would only get you Garchomp C Lv.X, and Cyrus+Radar can do that. Aaron is probably good. I pulled them when reworking some stuff and didn't add them back, yet.

    Uxie X is definitely an option. 4 Crobat may be too much, so swapping one or two out for any of the ones you mentioned is an easy preference tweak.

    The idea with 4 Crobat is to maximize the chance of starting with one. It really helps both Sableye and Honchkrow G. Also, in some cases, you may want the ability to Collector for 3 Crobat. Immagine playing vs. Jumpluff or Gyarados. They have a fair chance of starting with a 30HP (Karp/Hoppip) and a 50/60 (Sableye/Baltoy). Collector for 3 Crobat = KO. Then Special Dark and maybe a Poketurn = double donk. It could happen.

  • b-rock

    If you feel that strngly about it, then keep 3 of them, but never 4, too much for something you don't want to get stuck with.

  • PKMNPrime

    I don't think you need 3 Basic Dark. Since you're already running 4 SP. Dark, it shouldn't be that big of a problem to drop one since Garchomp C X uses DCE mostly. I'd also drop a Crobat G.

    -1 Crobat G
    -1 Basic Dark

    +1 Uxie Lv. X
    +1 Aaron's Collection

    Finally, I don't know if this is a good decision or not, but I've found VS Seeker works wonders in SP. Just 1 though, so for that I'd take out a TGW or a Cyrus.

    I've never tested this though, so I may be totally off haha.

  • http://www.teamomar.com/ Ed

    After reading/considering the comments from you and b-rock, I think you're probably right. 4 Crobats could be fun, but it's probably not worth it. I'm wrestling with the energies a bit. I don't really like having less basic energy than Cyrus. Maybe 3 special and 3 basic, but the argument could easily be made to run less Cyrus or just not care if you miss an energy grab.

    So, whatever the outcome of that struggle, it should open at least 2 spots. I agree that Aaron should probably be put back.

    I do like Uxie X, the problem is that there aren't any search cards to support it. To add the X would mean adding Bebe/Communication/Premier. That's not horrible, though. It just takes a bit of a shift.

    Chatot MD is another that I like. It gives some new options for the deck. A single Moonlight Stadium could also be nice, since Honchkrow can retrieve it.

  • PKMNPrime

    Those are great suggestions as well, I'm just really fond of the Uxie Lv. X in SP variants because of what it brings to the table. To me, it seems like why not run it if you're already running 2 Uxie LA?

    It helps so much against the Machamp match-up it's insane, but I understand where you're coming from because there is no reason in adding it in if you're not going to be able to search it out. If you were to add it in, try fitting in the Communication as well since your hand will be sort of clogged with Sableye late game.

  • http://www.teamomar.com/ Ed

    So, this is fairly off-topic but maybe still interesting/entertaining. I do own an Uxie Lv. X. I bought it off of eBay. After winning, I found out that the seller was Silvestro, who just happened to be one of the guys that started all the hype about this deck when he did so well with it in Florida. It goes full circle, because I'm now selling it on eBay, myself.

    So, does this mean that Silvestro doesn't play Uxie X in his deck, because he sold his? :P

  • K1

    Slightly off-topic also, in another tcg I am friends with the top singles seller on ebay and we have used information as to what top players are buying and selling to see what type of decks people are playing. I would be anxious to see what his ebay name is.

  • holon

    I am pretty sure that the deck played 1 Ambipom.

    ;X

  • http://www.teamomar.com/ Ed

    This makes a lot of sense. Thanks.

  • http://www.teamomar.com/ Ed

    Heh Heh! That is pretty crafty. It's not really my place to give out someone's eBay info, though.

  • PKMNPrime

    Possibly, but I can't imagine that he doesn't have two Uxie Lv. X considering he's the World Champion and I'm sure he would need 1 incase he ran an SP deck (which almost always uses an Uxie Lv. X).

    It's really preference I guess, but if you're not able to donk/hand manipulate them early with Sableye, be prepared to have a tough game against Machamp…

  • b-rock

    Trust me, I know the Silvestro's, and I'm pretty sure that an Uxie X or 2 is no big deal for them, especially considering some of the other stuff that the have, including an Illustrator Pikachu.

  • http://www.teamomar.com/ Ed

    Yeah, the bit about them selling their only Uxie X was a joke.

  • tomic25

    surrender now or prepare to fight! Team Rockets rockin! talking trouble, talking trouble, talking trouble, big trouble, gonna capture pikachu. Team Rockets Rockin! haha

  • Willy G

    If this deck becomes popular, people are going to start using Shiftry (Rising Rivals) to negate Cyrus's Initiative and Super Scoop Up. Also, Let Loose makes it easy for Shiftry to get a confusion lock.

  • PKMNPrime

    Not so sure about that 1 lol.

  • http://www.adamcapriola.com/ Adam Capriola

    yeah I don't think so

  • Jose Can C

    This looks a lot like a modified HOPE deck, go OR-EE-GON

  • djerf

    omar, can you post that cursegar list for me. Thomas (from dreamers)

  • RA-FUCKIN'-DU

    I built and tested this deck fairly extensive, but honestly the deck is fairly mediocre, to be perfectly honest I feel like its the surprise factor that got Silvestro his states now that its known I feel like it wont have a huge impact its just that if you dont get off right away and are playing a good player you pretty much lose. I gayrados or any stage two deck get even a decent set up are near auto loses.

    That being said my build is significantly different from yours. Mine abuses honcho SV(which silvestro did run) and giratina x. ALSO not running 2-3 moonlight is insane.

  • RA-FUCKIN'-DU

    HOPE is a joke deck. Sry

  • RA-FUCKIN'-DU

    Think before you write something

  • RA-FUCKIN'-DU

    SRY good players are good and bad players are bad

  • Xicious

    1 Roseanne and 1 Flint's are needed as they prove to be too useful in a lot of situations not to have, I also like 1 Looker's just to ensure you shuffle back Karps(either impersonate cyrus if you go first and grab the lookers or just impersonate lookers if you go second). Drop the spray to 3 no one runs 4 sprays no matter how disruption based the deck may be. Not a fan of the ssu personally and would rather go more after an SP deck, I went 1-1 Mismagius(crash chant) as a mew2 counter and a way to get rid of your belts as they may become a liability, also toxipromo as a luxray counter since lux one shots bleye's and krows. Absol SW may prove useful , he's a cool donker and the hand discard with spray back up is pretty intense but I think that needs to be tested.

  • Aeragon

    If you're interested in disruption and hand control, how about SLowking HGSS to control what they draw into next to ensure they never get something that refreshes their hand. And how about adding in a Porygon 2 tech to get to play 2 supporters in a turn? 2 TGMs after a Giratina or lost TGW give the opponent extremely little options.

  • Omar_Reyhan

    After testing this deck last night, i have to agree with radu, that its the surprise factor that this deck has over everyone. All in all, its ok, does really well against low hp decks (sp, pluff) but struggles if the opponent can get something going early like a donphan. Spiritomb and luxray make it really annoying as well, but the power of the deck i see is mostly the surprise factor. If you can see it coming, it can be played around and easliy handled.

  • Jose Can C

    We of TEAM DOMINATION agree, it is a suprise factor, deck is above avg at best

  • no name

    way to butcher up my list :[

  • RA-FUCKIN'-DU

    way to post your list so we can butcher it

  • http://www.teamomar.com/ Ed

    way to be useless ]:

  • MamoPig For The Win

    JordanBaker, 1 day ago in reply to JWittz, “thats why I'm sticking with my Burmy/Mamoswine/Electric deck. gotta play what you're comfortable with.”

  • Waxman

    My son played the Silvestro list in GA states and got second in Seniors. I would say your list is 6-8 cards off and most of what has been said here is such a joke. Silvestro using Honch SV?? Chatot MD??? Where do you guys get this stuff? Surprise factor is gone and we are on to the next secret deck.

  • RA-FUCKIN'-DU

    trash players are trash

  • Murder

    The Honch made it look somewhat fun to play and somewhat different

  • try to geuss who I am

    Boring!!! Back to techy archetypes for me, especially since I can now expect a million and 2 copies of this deck that don't work being played by players that would perform really well of they were to just put in their own effort and develop their own decks to play with. This is why I like the Japanese manor of discussion, much like you guys and and sixprizes.com, where all you need is someone to start a conversation and you'll get some constuctive thoughts, but forums are losing their efficiency, especially 'Gym. But thank you again for making Regionals so much easier this year.

  • http://www.teamomar.com/ Ed

    I'd be surprised if this article has any real effect on regionals, but it would be entertaining if it did. You'd be very welcome.

    Thanks for chiming in. It gots to show that you don't just have to make decklist suggestions to be constructive.

    Oh, and do I HAVE to try to guess who you are?

  • http://www.teamomar.com/ Ed

    If you're running those, yeah, I think you'd want the Moonlight. In the article's current build, there isn't much that you can't easily retreat or PokeTurn.

    I think I saw part of your deck. It seems less donkish than the one posted here. I can't say which would be better, but I feel like the current format has a lot of decks that are donkable.

    I think you're right about the surprise factor being the big deal. I also suggest that all teams get together and practice their RPS skills before regionals. That could be the key to earning those byes.

  • try to geuss who I am

    Unless you're from Florida or someone who personally knows me (mostly Floridians), then I'd highly suggest against it since I haven't been to active recently. But for those who care to try, here are some hints:

    I'm in the masters division in Florida.
    I mostly hang out with some of more recognizable names from there, but I do enjoy helping those with less experience then I.
    I am very enthusiatic about collecting and have gathered more than one japanese item that is almost impossible to find (including a charizard sketch deck box, PSA 10 mysterious pearl, and the original japanese tournament sleeves)
    I prefer techy decks that are mostly my own, but I tend to build copies of winning decks just because I have nothing else to do.
    I'm currently happiest when playing Gyarados and Luxchomp, but I have been trying to find out how other countries metagames go, but I don't know where to find their forums.
    And just for the heck of it, my attendance has been pretty random recently with anything POP hosted.

  • Saturn

    I know your name: Troll!

    Besides if any of that was true WHY IN THE WORLD do you care or even POSTING?

    Just by YOU posting, proves two things:
    1. Trying to hide something. (You can't hide a deck that won a tournament for very long with the Internets, sorry.)
    2. TROLL

    So… yeah…by the way Gyarados and Luxchomp are BOTH POPULAR decks that are on the internet! So why are you concern about this one? It's no different…or is it? O_o LOL

  • you found me out

    Well I have done a pretty good job at obscuring information, and I've managed to find a few new interesting ways of building several things, but no matter where I look, I have still yet to find anyone give away the critical bits, but that's just my searching.

    I am trying to hide something, and believe me, it's still hidden, and it's even hit the internet already. But that's where it pays to be well experienced at obscuring information.

    Oh well, time to find a new website to get some laughs out of.

  • Rish

    what about absol sw…wager+baleful wind….seems good though

  • tybojames

    Pretty funny how everyone was saying this is a joke deck and Profit one regionals with a variant. Lol @ that.

  • http://www.teamomar.com/ Ed

    Yeah, and it got second in my regional. It's definitely not a joke deck. I think that was clear from States. What wasn't clear to me (at the time) is how potent it really can be. When Omar first built and tested it, it was with a fairly unoptimized build and very little experience running the deck.

    He now has a better version and plays it better. Last night I tried my luck against him. It was frustrating beyond belief. Let me just say that if “SPionage” gets a nice start, you won't. Here's about how it went. Sableye starts the game with Collector for Giratina and some other junk. I have a great draw, but can't Lv. X on my first turn. I attack for something small. He plays a bunch of stuff and then Giratina. I think from there it was like Chatot G and 2 Cyrus's Initiative (thanks to Impersonate). The rest was a slow, frustrating, and painful death. It's so maddening.

  • James

    You should really use 4 initiative, and less wager. The original deck didn't even run a single copy of wager.

  • http://www.teamomar.com/ Ed

    I agree. I haven't looked at the deck in a while. Now, I would run Judge instead of Wager. I figure that some players that like RPS would still try Wager, though.

  • No Idea

    Well Aaron Curry's list at FL States ran at least 3, so I don't know where you are pulling this bullshit from. I played against him, did you?

  • http://www.teamomar.com/ Ed

    I just reread my reply. Just to clear it up, I meant that I agree that I'd want more Initiative. The Wager is still good, but now I think I'd prefer Judge in those slots.

  • luxray

    How many moonlight to you guys think should be played and how many superscoop-up? There has to be some way of getting giratina out of the active spot if it gets pulled out there.

  • http://www.teamomar.com/ Ed

    I've not messed with the deck in a while, but I'm not convinced that it needs any Moonlight. With Judge out now, I think you can run less Giratina (I'm thinking 2 max). Run a Warp Point or two and probably 4 Super Scoop Up. In my mind, SSU is one of those cards that seems like you either run 0 or 4. I'll try to get Omar to reply, though. He's worked on different versions of this recently.

  • luxray

    Thanks for the help! Im trying to decide if judge is a good card to play in this deck. I think using giratina and then impersonating Cyrus's impersonation is alot more disruptive than just playing judge, or impersonating judge early on. Also, was scoop up played in J-wittz list or in the Silvestro, Curry lists and how many were played? I can't seem to find room for 4 of them in my list.

  • Omar

    Luxray,

    As for your decision on SSU and moonlight, i have played the deck enough and teched enough that i don't see any reason for moonlight. The chances of you starting giratina isnt high enough for it to be that much of an issue, and on top of that, any normal player runs some sort of switch card, like warp. But i have yet to have that issue. Also, SSU would be nice, but your hp counts are pretty low as it is, and the only realy things SSU will do for you is get giratina up or re-use uxie or an SP chatot or crobat. But turns are more consistent and there are better things to put in those 4 slots imo then SSU. Judge is a great help though. It made it so i could lower the giratina count to 1, and have another searchable way to scrap a hand. Yeah, giratina and cyrus combo is more disruptive, but there is also the fact that giratina takes a bench slot, and you can flip double tails with your cyrus. Isn't likely, but it can happen, and there are times that you play judge from your hand, and then sableye. But i tested it for the longest time sure that i was going to play it, but i wouldnt say that i'm an expert or know 100% exactly the way it is “supposed” to be, just what i liked and what i didnt. I would try out all the ideas and make a decision that fits your play style

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  • http://www.teamomar.com/2010/08/06/sablock-deck-list-aka-sablelock-decklist/ Team Omar » Blog Archive » Sablock Deck List (aka Sablelock Decklist)

    [...] showings in certain State Championships), we covered it. At that time, TeamOmar.com ran a Sablelock Deck Workshop in which we discussed how the deck worked and, with reader help, built a workable list for [...]